Tesla suspension FATAL FLAW entire fleet should be grounded


#21

Okay, watch this from 5:00:

Seems the front suspension of the model 3 has a plastic upper wishbone - that’s not something I’ve seen before.

If it was a good idea then manufacturers of lightweight track cars like Caterham would’ve latched onto it I’d imagine, as it saves both weight and money…

But I don’t think they have?

I reckon that, in their attempts to make an electric car handle and accelerate better than a BMW M3, despite having a far heavier drivetrain and costing less, Tesla are cutting corners in an irresponsible manner.

Btw, I’m not attempting to derail this thread, but if I get too far off topic please feel free to move my posts.


#22

Yes, I know about the plastic Model 3 giblets but let’s keep on track…
The extruded aluminium links mean that every single Tesla Model S and Model X is a disaster waiting to happen.
Tesla has been covering up this defect from day 1.
I will shortly be putting up a collection of photographs showing hundreds of case of back wheels gone whompy due to snapped links.
Watch this space.


#23

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has announced Porsche will have to recall five units of the 918 Spyder hybrid supercar.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has announced Porsche will have to recall five units of the 918 Spyder hybrid supercar.

Paying $845,000 on a vehicle doesn’t make it immune to technical problems as even the mighty Porsche 918 Spyder is having some issues with the rear axle control arms. There’s a risk these might break which is why NHTSA says Porsche will have to recall five U.S.-spec units built between May 7 and June 18 to replace them (if necessary) free of charge.

If we were to imagine a worst-case scenario, the driver is involved in an accident after losing control of the 918 Spyder following the malfunction of the rear axle control arms. A Porsche spokesman says an additional 45 cars sold worldwide have already been inspected and the problem has been fixed.

It all started on June 26 when Porsche noticed this issue while conducting “heavy duty durability testing” in Italy at the Nardo test track. The problematic parts were further investigated and on July 18 the company issued a stop-sale in order to better check the 918 Spyder’s suspension components. All affected owners were contacted by Porsche and asked not to use the supercar on track.

Hello…HELLO??

I say…HELLO!!!

MAY 27 2018
CHRIS BRUCE
Parts of the rear suspension could crack, and Porsche intends to replace the parts with stronger pieces.
Sorry, Porsche 918 Spyder owners because you’ll need to take your supercar to the dealer for a recall. Porsche will repair 305 examples of the 2015 model year 918 in the United States because the connecting shafts for the suspension control arms could crack.

Porsche’s analysis found that the “connecting shafts of the longitudinal and transverse control arms might be vulnerable to cathodic stress corrosion cracking.” The company believes that the problem affects the components’ long-term reliability, and they require replacement.

Porsche will replace these parts with more stronger versions, and the work will require seven to eight hours to complete. The automaker reports that it has no reports of actual incidents related to this problem.

The 918 Spyder has been subject to multiple recalls. The first was all the way back in 2014 when five of them required replacement of the rear axle control arms. Unspecified chassis components also needed fixed later. In 2015, yet another campaign addressed possible damage to the wiring harness, and the firm had to inspect the entire production run for a potential problem with the seatbelts in 2016. Porsche also previously repaired the front lower control arms for possible cracking at the ball joints.


#24

As much as people like KeefWivaneff are demonized for being a Tesla short and a Tesla critic; I think some of the much hated, suppressed, and demonized; criticism is actually improving the product, safety and the chances of the long-term survival of Tesla. Though it seems KeefWivaneff is trying to profit from the short-term failures of Tesla; KeefWivaneff and others that are pointing out the problems and shortcomings of Tesla; may actually help the long-term survival of Tesla, if Tesla takes heed rather than the status quo of retaliating and covering up.

The Tesla cult, much like Nazi-ism; isn’t tolerant of criticism, Free Press and Free-Speech!

Suspension upgrades, allegedly for ride comfort? Could this be a an attempt to soften the ride, but also to covertly to reduce the stress on weak poorly designed/manufactured suspension parts and poor quality control? Is this a somewhat misguided covert attempt to reduce suspension failures?

A quote from Elon Musk.
Braking & UI upgrades apply to all Model 3s. Improved windshield for aero noise & suspension for ride comfort are major ops. Unless you’re really bothered by them, don’t replace. Best way to improve ride is drop tire pressure to ~39 psi. 45 psi is best range, but lower comfort.

I’m not doubting that making the ride softer on relatively smooth roads could reduce stress and failures during conservative driving. However the downside of making the ride smoother, is that it tends to increase incidents of bottoming out the suspensions parts at the end stops, thus can cause more failures during hard-driving, fast driving and on rough roads, potholes, etc.

It’s hard to tell by the crude and limited photos that KeefWivaneff posted, however in my opinion at least one photo seems to indicate metal fatigue. One photo appears to show a possible inclusion, that could be a source of the particular failure, which might be a sign of quality control, materials and manufacturing problems.

For those of you that may not have basic education regarding “inclusions” regarding metal failures. This example doesn’t necessarily involve the type of metals or type of inclusion, in regards to Tesla. It is merely a basic engineering and materials example regarding metallurgy.

Elon Musk is suggesting lowering the air pressure on the tires to smooth the ride. This not only reduces efficiency, it can increase the risk of tire damage, tire failure, rim damage, accidents, injuries, deaths, etc.

So the proposed actions by Lord King Coprolite (Eon Musk) seems to be just a stopgap measure, rather than a true fix of what seems to be a poorly designed weak suspension system.

Also the vibration problems that many Tesla customers are experiencing, can contribute to metal fatigue that can result in component failure, injury and death.

Instead of banning, slandering, harassing, hacking, attacking, banning, censoring safety advocates, skeptics and critics; Tesla, Elon Musk and his cult of suck ups should appreciate and take heed.

Reportedly Elon Musk hung up on a government safety investigator. If true it indicates that Elon Musk is a greedy evil tyrant with an anger management problem; that doesn’t care about safety or authority. Also it shows that Tesla is disrespectful of those killed by their unsafe products and overhyped marketing.

"Elon Musk hung up on NTSB chairman during a call regarding deadly Model X crash "


Tesla's & Elon Musk's neo-Nazi Gestapo might come after you; if you exercise free speech and/or free press
#25

Why did you link to a study on inclusions in rolled steel when the problem appears to be due to incorrectly aligned grain structure in extruded aluminium?

Also, this problem is mainly with the model S, so why are you linking to Musk’s statements on the model 3?

Looks like misdirection to me.


#26

Pot calling kettle. Or would troll be a better fit?

Yes, your post is misdirection.

"In mineralogy, an inclusion is any material that is trapped inside a mineral during its formation.

The term “inclusion” is also used in the context of metallurgy and metals processing. During the melt stage of processing hard particles such as oxides can enter or form in the liquid metal which are subsequently trapped when the melt solidifies. The term is usually used negatively such as when the particle could act as a fatigue crack nucleator or as an area of high stress intensity."


#27

So you can’t explain why you linked to an article on a completely different type of weakness in a completely different metal than the one under discussion, then call me a troll, accuse me of your own failings, and link to an article on mineral inclusions in order to misdirect me further?

Oh, and your NASA.gov PDF is 122 pages long and concerned with aerospace applications - care to tell me which part is relevant to the discussion before I waste my time reading it all?

Or is timewasting and derailing your purpose here?

Along with the forum slide you initiated earlier, of course…

Know what? Don’t reply. I’m not interested.

https://cryptome.org/2012/07/gent-forum-spies.htm


#28

I’m no expert on metallurgy but it is easy to understand that in any metal casting (and that possibly includes extruded metals) it is possible to get defects caused by voids or impurities.

It is quite apparent that Teslas do suffer a high number of broken parts that have the appearance of weak cast metal leading to brittle fractures.


#29

Someone linked to this thread on Reddit:

There are some very intelligent replies, all confirming that the use of aluminium extrusions is not good practice, and the reasons are nothing to do with inclusions. That’s a deliberate strawman/red herring.

You can maybe get away with such components on race cars, which have far shorter design lifetimes, but for a vehicle intended to do hundreds of thousands of miles on public roads it is a very bad idea indeed.

Who knows, maybe Tesla have some weaselly small print in their contract concerning the matter to obviate blaim?

If not, they’re going to get sued into oblivion.

Edit to include: Looks like at least some of these parts were in fact cheap castings rather than extrusions, which are even weaker:

Jesus Christ, this just gets worse and worse don’t it?


#30

No need for 122 page NASA.gov PDFs, it took me two minutes to find this on Google:

https://baforging.com/extrusion-vs-casting-vs-forging/

Seems that, if aluminium was to be used, forging is by far the best method. However, Tesla chose to use extrusions, then gave up on that and used cheap, shoddy casting instead, as this photo shows:

What the hell kind of metal is that thing made of? Old beer cans and the sweepings off the factory floor?!?

Anyone who has had such suspension malfunctions should definitely not sign any non disclosure agreements and instead get in touch with a lawyer, as this is gross negligence, if not outright fraud, by Tesla.

In a sane world all the affected vehicles would be recalled and the production lines shutdown whilst their supply chain was investigated.


#31

I believe this Tesla suspension arm is forged.
Badly!


#32

To be fair, all Tesla suspension components seem to be forged inasmuch as they are the product of forgery:

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/forgery

Seriously though, the owner of the Tesla that pot metal looking doohickey came off should get to a lawyer asap, cos that just ain’t acceptable. There must be a class action suit in all this malarkey, is there no Keen young legal eagle out there willing to do the legwork?

Or are they all too scared of invoking the wrath of the Silicon Valley Mafia and their Wall Street cronies?

Ultimately I stick to my original premise - Tesla have tried to scrimp and shave every gram of weight possible in the construction of their cars, in order to offset the extra weight of the electric drivetrain and useless gimmicks like gullwing doors, but have done so in the most cackhanded, cheapskate, fashion possible, and the result is catastrophic failures that are costing lives…

Not cool at all.